Starting AP | Arthritis Information
I've decided to start the Antibiotics Protocol. For those that are not aware I manage my RH with diet and supplements.
I've been doing a lot of research the last couple of weeks, and have become convinced that AP may be able to help me advance for the better.
I followed an elimination diet several years ago and was able to start reversing RH. I reduced my RF and can bring my inflammation levels down, all through diet.
As we all know RH is a battle, over the last 7 years I've had about 3 relapses back into more active RH solely due to becoming lazy on the diet I follow. I know EXACTLY which foods/drinks trigger the RH and allow the bacteria that triggers it to grow and repopulate the effected sites, trouble is I love red wine, coffee and chocolate.
One of the interesting features of the elimination diet is the Herx (die off) effect that occurs, which also occurs with AP. My initial hesitation with AP (funny how I dismissed it out of hand all those years ago) was it's effect on the gut. This instantly scrubbed it of my list, as I believe the Gut is at the route of the problem, or at least a very big part in RH. I even worked with a girl that had Chronic Fatigue who could directly relate it to taking Minocin for Acne. However having read up on peoples experiences with AP, I'm more confident that Minocin can be taken safely when taking Probiotics, and managing your diet.
I feel I have an added advantage, since I don't take any other medications, and I have the knowledge of the foods that trigger RH. I read many posts on this site and others where I can directly relate to peoples symptoms. It's all in the GUT, and the only way I've found to help the gut to heal is through eliminating the substances that irritate it. My initial assumptions were that Candida was the sole course of RH, and many of us will know that this can only be eradicated through dietary constraints, however Candida hasn't been found in joints, but the AP bacteria has, so Candida can't be the complete picture.
Leaky Gut (caused by stress, Candida) seems to be the main culprit, letting in stuff that shouldn't move around your body. This then allows bacteria (like Candida) to thrive in places it shouldn't.
Anyhow, I want to keep people posted on how AP goes. It will be interesting to see the initial effects of the drug and whether my stomach can handle it etc.
Good Luck with your therapy!
As one RBF member so succinctly put it, improvement is glacial.
Ron
That is interesting to hear the theory re antibiotics for acne and later chronic fatigue. In high school (around ages 14-18) I was on antibiotics for long periods of time, for acne. (It never helped though!) I think I was on tetracycline. Does that sound right? Anyway, I got mono at age 22, that turned into what was considered (but never formally dx) as "chronic fatigue syndrome). Finally got over it after my pregnancies (which, ironically, apparently put RA or AS or whatever this is into high gear. I'd had some early problems with my feet before the mono, that were helped with NSAIDS).
I feel like I am too busy to have the time/energy that AP would require (and my doctor hasn't even mentioned it). I work full time and have 2 young kids. Thoughts on that? Must you have the time to devote to it to make it work?
Right around the time that RA started, I also developed interstitial cystitis. I was able to resolve that my avoiding--for a month--caffeine, coffee, veggies, OJ, almost everything but milk, fruits, a few other oddball things. (It developed while I had a habit of drinking OJ in the morning, Red Bull at lunch, and V8 at dinner--not good for the bladder). But while I was on the safe diet is when the RA went into its worst flare. Once I went off that diet, the cystitis was gone, but the RA remained and got worse.
Katie,
Checkout this website:
http://www.nutritionhelp.com/
Erica White had Chronic Fatigue for years, and has a lot to say about it. She identified the link between Antibiotics and chronic illness later in life.
[QUOTE=KatieG]
MTX takes more time with it's fatigue and hangovers.
Good luck with your AP, Greeno. I think you're making the right decision.
OMG - I soooo agree with what you just posted. It's the gut! I swear it's the gut! OK, enough ranting.
OK, questions - I hadn't heard about coffee effecting the bacteria. Would that be tea too? How about green tea?
I don't know if I'd agree that ABX cause diseases but I do think they can start us down that road - what with MD's indiscriminantly handing them out and not telling us about the need for probiotics and protecting the gut. So, if you were on them for years, dealt with a poor diet, had unusual stress and add in some environmental triggers and TADA!!! an AI disease is born.
Do you have a link to the info about candida not being found in the joints?
Your stomach can handle AP. All you need to do is get used to the minor side effects (nausea, gassiness etc) which tends to go away in a couple of months. Maybe some dizziness. Keep an eye on your probiotic levels. If BM's become too loose, up the dose. You should be fine!
And, since I did this post from your post I can't see who said about AP and time. My take? It's time that made me choose AP. I wanted time with my child that included playing and running and building forts. I got it!
Pip
Pip - Regarding Coffee and Tea, well yes.
Checkout this link for
Joseph Hackett. I followed the same diet that Joseph did, lots of good information here.
http://jhackett_ra.tripod.com/
Like I've indicated before, I believe candida plays a big part in RH.
If we all have leaky Guts which Candida inhabit then candida will feed
on anything it can extract sugar from. Coffee is a stimulant which
induces your body to release it's own stored sugars. When I first
started on my diet I was drinking coffee in the morning since (believe
it or not) coffee helps a too acidic system get back into balance, and
I still experience this today. However, over the years the yeast that
has invaded my system has been able to mutate, and now finds coffee
quite pleasurable. Candida will find a way to consume any form of
sugar, whether its sucrose, lactose,
fuctrose, or your own body sugars.
Fermented tea, such as green tea is no good either. Anything that
contains yeast is no good for me. I don't really understand the science
behind it, but my theory (probably very week), is either candida can
extra sugar or something from other yeasts, or these food bound yeasts
get through your leaky gut, and cause havoc. So things like cured
meats, teas, stock cubes, ham, bacon etc aren't that good.
Yes I agree with you regarding the
ABX cuase of disease. Usually people talk of having anti-
biotics
at some stage in there lives, and then some years later they get some
chronic disease. If people on AP can stay on AP by taking
probiotics then this is evidence enough for me of the efficiency of pro-
b's protecting your gut.
I find it very interesting that people are able to reverse the symptoms
of RH on AP, as this only proves that AP is not that harmful to the gut
(when combined with
probiotics).
With my diet, I can see the reversal of the condition only if all
effecting foods are eliminated for several months. I'm hoping that AP
is powerful enough that I won't have to be as strict with the diet. In
my mind AP must be killing of Candida as well as getting to the stuff
in your joints. If it wasn't then I don't see how it could work. There
was a poster recently that talked about there wife going back on dairy,
and starting to have pain even when on AP. This makes sense to me,
since if you can't digest lactose or milk in general then it's only
going to give Candida (as well as damaging your gut) the winning edge.
Sorry - candida not found in joints was an assumption of mine. Strike it from the record :)
Hey Greeno!
Thanks for the info on candida - you're gonna be my new best friend so maybe I can pick your brain now and again. LOL I'm trying to learn all I can about candida. I'm a fine example of those who didn't practice 'safe probiotics' on AP and my underlying yeast got one hell of a foothold. I'm lucky as heck I didn't ruin my chances with AP because of that.
So, good to know about the tea. I kind of knew it...but was hoping otherwise. Sigh. When it runs out I won't be buying more. Somehow I was under the impression Green Tea wasn't fermented.
I don't think it's only antibiotics - but I do think that anything that disrupts the gut allows the baddies to get an upper hand. Another strong link is stress. It's amazing what those microbes like -> they seem to live off the hormones like adrenalin - which is stress related. And insulin -> another hormone.
You know - when I heard people talking about their disease reversing, I really did think it was some sort of 'group think'. Now that it happened to me, I think of it more as a war and the body is taking back some of the lost territory. Did I tell you I have a friend that reversed her PRA with diet? Just like us! But, if she accidently gets something on her 'no-no' list she flares. I do know people on probiotics say they can have more 'offending' foods - so I've always wondered what would happen for those who did both. I'm guessing that because you've done the diet part, your reversal will be a lot less noticiable - but would you keep an eye on it and let me know. I'm curious as heck!
Are you familiar with the MP? These guys are sort of 'AP Amped' and are the only ones out there claiming we can get a cure. They are against vitamin D, which I can see because their science seems to be impecable - even if it's against most current research. What I can't agree with is some of their talk about yeast. I know of one guy that said he just stopped his probiotics (and they're on multiple antiobiotics) because he just didn't need it any more and he can eat pretty much anything nowadays. Yeah, while I think that might be the truth when DONE with the MP - I think that's taking a HUGE risk and may cause even more problems down the road. Check them out and give me your opinion, please.
Also, I think its a delicate balance. I think of it as slowly (and WHY does it always have to be slow!!!) rebalancing your system. You're replacing the bad flora with good (and man, does yeast want your GI 'prime real estate', or what) and killing off the other microbes at the same time. Too much in either direction and you take a step back. But, find that delicate balance and MAN, we've got a shot!
Hugs,
Pip
P.S. What do you think of the apple cider drink to kill candida? I've been doing that when I can remember.
Good Luck with your decision. Pray it does for you what it did for me - gave me back my life.
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