Greed is out of control in the world...Crazy times.....who can you trust anymore?
some people. They don't even care if they hurt people
along the way of their scheming and lying and stealing.
horrendous... puts good advisors to shame... I hope they throw the book at him.. and his hedge fund!!
horrendous... puts good advisors to shame... I hope they throw the book at him.. and his hedge fund!!
So what are the consequences of his actions? Who loses money. I just do not understand...it goes right over my head.
edited to add: He is facing 20 years in prison and a 5 million dollar fine. Doesn't seem like enough.
In addition, as IO stated above... there will be lawsuits by individuals or a class action if they all group together... (individually may be better) since these people were basically swindled ... they are entitled to sue and be given restitution as judged by the Finra/SEC -- I am not exactly sure which would have jurisdiction, but I believe FINRA... this man's company will be ordered to pay back the loss... usually these cases don't go to civil court, but you never know......
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/12/13/business/13fraud.html?_r=1&adxnnl=1&partner=rss&emc=rss&adxnnlx=1229145550-CZczzp8Z/JMGGNMC63D5WA
This artical in the NewYork Times explains a little more. It is a quick read. Just a little more info.
qoute from article:
"Victims of the scam included gray-haired grandmothers in Florida"
This story still freaks me out.
I mean wrap your mind around 50 Billion......How can anyone get away with that for so long.
[QUOTE=inflamedOnline]
[/QUOTE]
I haven't actually read the articles, but I'm guessing no regulators were overseeing what was going on.[QUOTE=Gimpy-a-gogo] [QUOTE=inflamedOnline]
I mean wrap your mind around 50 Billion......How can anyone get away with that for so long.
[/QUOTE]
I haven't actually read the articles, but I'm guessing no regulators were overseeing what was going on.[/QUOTE]
Sorry, you should read the article....you guessed wrong.
inflamedOnline2008-12-13 14:53:55This pyramid Fraud is the largest in HISTORY. It is horrible. If you read the last link it explains how he got by the "regulators"
[QUOTE=inflamedOnline] [QUOTE=Gimpy-a-gogo] [QUOTE=inflamedOnline]
[/QUOTE] I haven't actually read the articles, but I'm guessing no regulators were overseeing what was going on.[/QUOTE]
[/QUOTE]
Not sure why you felt the need to post that in big red letters. I was prepared to be wrong since I hadn't read the article. That's why I said "I'm guessing"
If you want to know how stuff like this happens, there's a great documentary you could rent called "Enron: the Smartest Guys in the Room"
It's quite shocking, really.I like big red letters. No offense meant.
Wonder why you would comment if you werent interested in reading the article. It has been all over the news. surprised you missed it. it is the weekend though. Again Gimmpy, have a nice weekend.
That article said:
The collapse of Mr. Madoff’s firm is yet another blow in a devastating year for Wall Street and investors. While Mr. Madoff’s firm was not a hedge fund, the scope of the fraud is likely to increase pressure on hedge funds to accept greater regulation and transparency and protect their investors.
and
Mr. Madoff was not running an actual hedge fund, but instead managing accounts for investors inside his own securities firm. The difference, though seemingly minor, is crucial. Hedge funds typically hold their portfolios at banks and brokerage firms like JPMorgan Chase and Goldman Sachs. Outside auditors can check with those banks and brokerage firms to make sure the funds exist.
But because he had his own securities firm, Mr. Madoff kept custody over his clients’ accounts and processed all their stock trades himself. His only check appears to have been Friehling & Horowitz, a tiny auditing firm based in New City, N.Y. Wealthy individuals and other money managers entrusted billions of dollars to funds that in turn invested in his firm, based on his reputation and reported returns.
So that does seem like another case of deregulation not working, to me.
So I think it's you that is wrong in this case, IO. Sorry.
Gimmpy,
Once again, you should read....and understand what you are reading...copy and pasting portions is not revealing the whole pic. There were checks and balances...this was fraud and all the regulations in the world will not stop fraud... Securities are regulated...really, as is the banking industry...we americans are not running amuck as a whole...it is the few greedy crooked, thiefs I have a problem with.
I have no problem with Canada. That is your country. America is mine.
Why are you being so growly at me?
Truth about the big red letters....you carried your comment from another thread to this one. Then didnt even take the time to educate yourself. I felt you were trolling.Ha! It's ridiculous to think that these shennanigans on Wall street don't have a global ricochet. They are global investments. The whole world is feeling the impact. Do you realise how much the value of my home has gone down because of this situation? So don't imply it's none of my business, or that I have a personal vendetta against the US. It's not personal and where it's physically located is irrelevant. You're the one making it an Us vs Them scenario, not me.
So, who was overseeing them, then? Besides one tiny private firm that obviously wasn't doing it's job. Where were the regulations?
Why don't you explain it to me, since you have such a firm grasp on what I'm not understanding?PS, actually, regulations will stop fraud if they're being appliedGimpy:
Well of course it affect the global market. You have no Idea what I do for a living, but you assume I am an idiot and you are superior.
I personally think you are a trouble maker.I have enough problems, I do not need you hounding me by twisting what I post. Stop the stupidity now.
Please have a nice Holiday, and I would like to leave this with you where it is.....you can even type a final word....
[QUOTE=inflamedOnline] Gimpy:
[/QUOTE]
So now you're calling me stupid? You're the one turning this into a personal issue. Which to me indicates you can't defend your opinion that Madoff's securities were properly overseen and regulated. They weren't.
PS. Saying things like "you assume I am an idiot and you are superior" is a straw dog argument. I never said anything like that, or even implied it. In fact, I asked you to explain to me what I'm not seeing (whihc I guess you are either unwilling or unable to do). Why don't you stick to the facts, what I said and what the article says, instead of turning it into a "you hate America" and a "you're picking on me" kind of thing?
From Wikipedia: A straw man argument is an informal fallacy based on misrepresentation of an opponent's position.[1] To "set up a straw man," one describes a position that superficially resembles an opponent's actual view, yet is easier to refute. Then, one attributes that position to the opponent. For example, someone might deliberately overstate the opponent's position.[1] While a straw man argument may work as a rhetorical technique—and succeed in persuading people—it carries little or no real evidential weight, since the opponent's actual argument has not been refuted.[2]
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