RD's debate whether fibromyalgia is a disease | Arthritis Information

http://www.kevinmd.com/blog/2009/11/rheumatologists-debate-fibromyalgia-disease.htmlAsk anyone who has it. Pretty simple really.

Dr Frederick Wolfe who was one the the rheumatologists who wrote the diagnositic criterea of fibromyalgia back in 1996 now believes that it should not exists as a seperate diagnosis...doesn't make the discussions about it any easier

I've always thought of this as a condition as opposed to a disease, since there are a number of genuine diseases that include fibromyalgia-like pain in their list of symptoms.

No offense to those who have been diagnosed with it, but I've wondered just how much the marketing ploys have sensationalized fibromyalgia and planted the bug into some people's brains.

There is mounting evidence that FMS [the condition] is linked to some psychiatric diseases.

Don't shoot the messenger! :-)

For one thing the pain and things I go through with this disease is not a figment of my imagination ..by far. I suffer through this everyday. I also have RA. the pair of them together battle each other. If I exercise to keep my joints limber I suffer with the fibro for doing so, The more I exercise or go through stessful times the worse the fibro is. Not like the RA If I do alot with RA I can have pain and sorness but the fibro can leave me bedridden for the day unable to walk on my own even to take care of the simpliest personal functions.

So by far it is not a figment of my imagination.

Some time ago Lynn49 posted a study on fibro sufferers. I have tried to find the url but no luck so far. I think you would find it most interesting Sam as most people do not even know of fibromyalgia just as they do not know about polymyalgia. I will keep looking because it was a most interest article.

Teeded, I'm trying to find that too [QUOTE=doobgirl32]For one thing the pain and things I go through with this disease is not a figment of my imagination ..by far. I suffer through this everyday. I also have RA. the pair of them together battle each other. If I exercise to keep my joints limber I suffer with the fibro for doing so, The more I exercise or go through stessful times the worse the fibro is. Not like the RA If I do alot with RA I can have pain and sorness but the fibro can leave me bedridden for the day unable to walk on my own even to take care of the simpliest personal functions.

So by far it is not a figment of my imagination.[/QUOTE]

No one said it's a figment of your imagination [at least I didn't] but my contention is that it's a CONDITION as opposed to a DISEASE.

Fibromyalgia Study: It's a Real Disease

Kamiah A. Walker
Medical Writer
SpineUniverse
Wheaton, IL

We don't know exactly what causes fibromyalgia, but now, thanks to French researchers, we have a clue. Fibromyalgia may be related to abnormal blood flow in specific areas of the brain.

Dr. Eric Guedj of the Centre Hospitalier-Universitaire de la Timone in Marseille, France, was the lead researcher in a study examining blood perfusion (abnormal blood flow) as a possible fibromyalgia cause.

"Past imaging studies of patients with [fibromyalgia]…have shown above-normal cerebral blood flow (brain perfusion) in some areas of the brain and below-normal in other areas," explains Dr. Guedj in a press release about the study. "After performing whole-brain scans on the participants, we used a statistical analysis to study the relationship between functional activity in even the smallest area of the brain and various parameters related to pain, disability, and anxiety/depression."

Translation: Dr. Guedj's team studied 30 women, 20 with fibromyalgia and 10 without it. The women answered various questionnaires used in the medical research field to quantify such things as pain levels and how severely fibromyalgia limits patients' lives.

http://www.spineuniverse.com/article/fibromyalgia-study-4474.html

I'd be interested in seeing the article.

I'm told that one pharmaceutical is pouring the money into round-the-clock television advertising with info on its drug for fibromyalgia. Based on that, it would be hard to believe that people [in that region at least] have not heard of fibromyalgia.

Psychiatric association: here are the results of one study. Of course, it doesn't conclude which came first, the chicken or the egg.

Abstract

Background: We compared ICD-10 psychiatric disorders in female patients with fibromyalgia (n=45) or functional dyspepsia (n=18) with age-matched random sample controls (n=49).

Method: Version 2 of The Schedules for Clinical Assessment in Neuropsychiatry (SCAN) was used for present state examination and lifetime diagnoses.

Results: Current psychiatric disorders (somatoform pain disorder and specific phobia omitted) were diagnosed in 80% of fibromyalgia patients (OR=8.3), 83% of functional dyspepsia patients (OR=10.3) and 33% controls. Among fibromyalgia patients 27% had lifetime panic disorder. Lifetime mood disorders were found in 83% of functional dyspepsia patients. First-degree relatives with psychiatric disorder were found in 16% of the fibromyalgia patients, 50% of functional dyspepsia patients and 20% of controls.

Conclusions: Fibromyalgia is associated with panic disorder and functional dyspepsia with mood disorders in substantial subgroups. Psychiatric symptoms and somatic complaints are closely related in these disorders.

People suffering from fibromyalgia have reduced activity in the parts of the brain that inhibit the experience of pain. Drugs that affect the CNS can be effective against the disease, and are thought to be even more so if administered early in its course. This according to a new thesis from the Swedish medical university Karolinska Institutet.

"It's a common misconception that fibromyalgia is a manifestation of mental problems," says Karin B. Jensen, postgraduate at the Department of Clinical Neuroscience. "But in the studies that comprise my thesis, we've made careful measurements and have found no correlation at all between pain sensitivity in fibromyalgia patients and the degree of anxiety or depression they show."

In one of the studies presented in the thesis, subjects had both thumbs pressed hard enough for them to feel the same degree of mild pain as healthy controls. Using functional magnetic resonance imaging (fMRI), researchers could show that the subjects had the same level of activity in the parts of the brain that deal with emotions as well assensory information from the thumb, regardless of which group they belonged to. However, the subjects with fibromyalgia had lower activity in a brain area that inhibits the experience of pain.

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/168434.php

[QUOTE=Sam1234]I've always thought of this as a condition as opposed to a disease, since there are a number of genuine diseases that include fibromyalgia-like pain in their list of symptoms. No offense taken Sam! I will just say that only one without the symptoms of fibro, would suggest its not a disease because if one has it, it sure feels like a disease rather than a condition! I had fibro loooooong before it was advertised on TV and other media, so I don't feel this influenced me at all. I didn't go to my doctor saying I thought I had fibro so give me... On the contrary, my doctors, PCP and RD, worked together to come up with this diagnosis and had to teach me the differenced between fibro pain and RA pain. I went through a host of test to make sure I didn't have some "genuine disease", including a psych evaluation. Nope, not crazy, (maybe just crazy enough

PS..I don't have fibro, so I really don't have a dog in this fight. The research seems to cut both ways though, so who can say Thanks for finding that one Lynn49. I cannot seem to figure out how to do searches yet. All I know is the one I was looking for was posted Nov. 3, 2008.

I agree Waddie, and this pain is nothing like hot flashes for sure.

I hope this answers some of your questions Sam.

Teed. are you sure about that date? I couldn't find one .....

I did find this one though:

Joined: 11�April�2007 Online Status: Online Posts: 3489
	NEW YORK (Reuters Health) Sep 18 - Neurologic signs are common in fibromyalgia patients and support the possibility that their symptoms have a neuroanatomical cause, according to an article in the September issue of Arthritis and Rheumatism. Dr. Nathaniel F. Watson, of the University of Washington Medicine Sleep Institute at Harborview, Seattle, and colleagues assessed the type and frequency of neurologic signs and symptoms in166 patients with fibromyalgia and 66 pain-free controls, all of whom were examined by a neurologist unaware of disease status. Participants also completed a standard questionnaire on neurologic symptoms. In 27 of 29 neurological categories tested, significantly more neurologic symptoms were observed in the fibromyalgia group than in the control group. The greatest differences were found for photophobia (70% versus 6%; p<0.01), poor balance (63% versus 4%; p<0.01), and weakness (58% versus 2%; p<0.01) and tingling (54% versus 4%; p<0.01) in the arms or legs. In addition, those with fibromyalgia had greater dysfunction than controls in cranial nerves IX and X (42% versus 8%; p<0.01), and more sensory findings (65% versus 25%; p<0.01), motor abnormalities (33% versus 3%; p<0.01), and gait problems (28% versus 7%; p<0.01). Within the fibromyalgia group, there were significant correlations between several signs and symptoms. For example, numbness in any part of the body (p=0.03) or tingling in the arms or legs (p= 0.05) were correlated with appropriate neurologic examination findings. Poor balance (p=0.01), poor coordination (p=0.01) and weakness in the arms or legs (p=0.03) were also correlated with objective findings. "This observation underscores the need to perform careful neurological examinations in all fibromyalgia patients, particularly those with neurological complaints," Dr. Watson told Reuters Health. "These findings suggest that in some fibromyalgia patients it may be beneficial to evaluate them for a possible neuroanatomical cause for their fibromyalgia, if their neurological examination findings are positive," he added. But, he pointed out, as of now "no study has reported the results of neurological examinations, radiological, and neuroimaging data that would permit recommendations to be made regarding which patients should be evaluated for neuroanatomical conditions." Dr. Watson cautioned that this study does not confirm a neuroanatomical basis for fibromyalgia and that much more work is necessary before this can be known with certainty. "Carefully performed neuroradiological studies are necessary, and these studies have not been done," Dr. Watson said. "The current study suggests that performing these future studies will be helpful to our understanding of this disease." Arthritis Rheum 2009;60:2839-2844.
	'For example' is not proof. - Jewish proverb

Thanks for the article above, Lynn49.

I can appreciate how having so much pain would translate to the sufferer as, "It's got to be a Disease rather than a Condition." I do. Really.

But what you need to understand that nearly ALL diseases were CONDITIONS before extensive research was done to find the causal factors and before a conclusion was made.....which evolved to the CONDITION being elevated to a DISEASE. So until they know the cause of FMS, it's stuck in the "condition" compartment.

How many of you are familiar with Guillain-Barre? Pretty devastating, right? But it's not a disease because they haven't figured out the cause of GBS. So it's a syndrome, or condition, until they do.

So take no offense to my take on FMS - until they know the exact cause, it's going to be called a syndrome or condition. And that doesn't mean it's unreal or the pain isn't great.

With respect to Lynn49's article immediately above my post: an excellent find. This, coupled with my knowledge that FMS is highly associated with psychiatric and psychological symptomology seems to lend more credence to the fact that the answers to FMS will be found in the field of Neurology.

Sam12342009-11-11 14:28:23http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/11/081103084040.htm

"Fibromyalgia is frequently considered an 'invisible syndrome' since musculoskeletal imaging is negative," said Eric Guedj, M.D., and lead author of the study. "Past imaging studies of patients with the syndrome, however, have shown above-normal cerebral blood flow (brain perfusion) in some areas of the brain and below-normal in other areas. After performing whole-brain scans on the participants, we used a statistical analysis to study the relationship between functional activity in even the smallest area of the brain and various parameters related to pain, disability and anxiety/depression."

This is the one I was looking for. I don't know if it is the same as yours Lynn but will go back and check.

Pat
Glad you were able to find it Here's my analogy.... America fought with Korea (It's late I can't remember the dates), what the movie and show MASH was about. The US never declared war, called it a police action or something to that affect. But ask the men who fought if they were in a war.

Does it really matter if it's called a disease or not?

Here's my analogy.... America fought with Korea (It's late I can't remember the dates), what the movie and show MASH was about. The US never declared war, called it a police action or something to that affect. But ask the men who fought if they were in a war.

Does it really matter if it's called a disease or not?

My feeling is that if anyone has a question that I am able to answer then I will do so to the best of my ability. I am sorry this post has upset you.