well if any of you have members in the military heres a wish for there save return...
I Think Iraq has now become a defacto war between Iran and Saudi Arabia and we are in the middle..
20,000 more troops will not fix this I am afraid to say
It is a full flung civil war with our troops in the middle Not a good place to be.
I really wish that hundreds of billions would have gone to medical reseach instead...
If Israel can build a wasp that flys around and kills people than what could we do if we had different priorities?
I think we could accomplish much if only our efforts were focused different..
how about a bionic hand lord knows i may need one some day
or 2
thoughts?
Mark,
Thank you, RASara82. I'm one of those with family over in Iraq. Literal family, and other Americans, who are part of my bigger "family."
Whether I, personally, would have chosen this particular path for the US to take or not, I'm not going to kick my family when they're in a tough spot, by criticizing our part in the war.
I'm sure, mark, that you don't intend to be offensive. But I think it's almost impossible to air political views without offending someone, so maybe it's a good topic to stay away from on this forum?
Amen!
God Bless our troops...and America.
And Blue Heron~I tend to agree with you. No matter which side you choose to support politically; there will always be folks that disagree with you. One thing I'm sure we all agree on though is that we are most grateful for the sacrifice our troops are making for our country. I pray that the Lord will protect them all.....and bless their families here at home during this Holiday season. No doubt this has to be the most difficult time of all.
Perhaps it is not the TROOPS that are being cirtized, since they only follow the orders that they are given, and rightfully so. But it is Bush and his administration that is to blame.
Why does everyone always assume that a person against the WAR is against the TROOPS. They are separate entities. To be opposed to war, is a good thing. We should try to be more focused on peace. I'm not saying go be a tree hugging hippie, but come on. Who really wants to fight.
I think it's a bad idea to "stay away" from political topics. Staying away from any topic in life only breeds ignorance. Everyone should be entitled to read about politics anywhere they can, and to see all different viewpoints and opinions. Politics is what this country is based on, and to not talk about it would bring the end of this nation.
I'm not for the war. But I've never been for ANY war. Sometimes we do need to step in. And sometimes we step in for too long. It's never the troops fault though. No one said "Hey private, do you think we should go to war?" Their responsibility is to their country. To be loyal and defend us. And when they are told "March" they march. When they are told "fight" they fight. And we are greatful. Many countries don't have that backbone. That, however, does not have anything to do with the "war" itself.
Please try to seperate the two, it will alleviate many headaches.
Blue Heron and Lovie I totally agree with you.
I don't think it is helpful to have political discussions on a health related board. We all know that stress gives us problems and most people have very strong political opinions. Why start something where there will be a lot of stress involved.
I love to discuss politics and I don't think anyone is suggesting that folks "stay away" from these topics. Just that there might be a better forum for the discussion than an RA board.
Let's make one
LoL I'm kidding.
[QUOTE=arriscolwell]Why does everyone always assume that a person against the WAR is against the TROOPS.[/quote]
I think you're making a broad assumption about my assumptions, arriscolwell! I don't think I ever accused mark1 or anyone else of being "against the troops." **checks post** Nope. I didn't. I wouldn't presume to make assumptions about how mark feels about war or troops. I like to think I'm more broad-minded than that. I don't appreciate being "filed away" in the camp of the intolerant either, thanks.
[QUOTE]To be opposed to war, is a good thing. We should try to be more focused on peace. I'm not saying go be a tree hugging hippie, but come on. Who really wants to fight.[/quote]
You're presenting your opinion as an inarguable fact. Is it a good thing to be opposed to war? Maybe. Maybe not. Is it a good thing to speak up for powerless people in the world who can't speak up for themselves? Is it a good thing, when you're the country with all the resources, to come to the aid of powerless people who've been oppressed by totalitarian governments for decades? Because some people might not see the war in quite the same black and white terms as you see it. Out of respect for those who think differently, you might state your opinions in less dogmatic terms.
[quote]I think it's a bad idea to "stay away" from political topics. Staying away from any topic in life only breeds ignorance. Everyone should be entitled to read about politics anywhere they can, and to see all different viewpoints and opinions. Politics is what this country is based on, and to not talk about it would bring the end of this nation.[/quote]
Oh, I'm sorry: did I imply that we should all stick our heads in the sand just to avoid the unpleasant subject of war? Because what I thought I was saying--and what others were saying--was maybe this forum isn't the time and place to talk about it. There's such a thing as discretion, and thumping a political podium in a medical support forum isn't necessarily it.
I don't think mark1 intended to spark a heated disagreement on the nature of American politics, but I feel that this is what it's turning into. I'm simply saying that I come to this RA board for support and advice about health. I don't want to hear political rants about why people think we have a crummy president. I hear enough of that on the CBS evening news.
Do people--as you put it--"have a right" to read about politics here? Of course: I know the First Amendment as well as you do. I'm not talking about Rights. I'm talking about good manners.
In my post I did not accuse Mark of being against the troops. I'm sure that he is very supportive of them. My point was that saying things like that may offend those who have lost loved ones, or whose loved ones are currently overseas. I don't suggest that we all have to keep our mouths shut, I just suggest that discretion is used when talking about such a sensitive topic. Also, the vast majority of our troops who are fighting or have fought, are in support of their cause....not simply following orders because they have to. So, speaking out against the war is speaking out against what they stand for. Everyone is more than welcome to voice their opinion, just keep in mind how it would feel to be on the other side. Mark, I have gone down this path. I love talking politics but have found it does not keep peace on the board. I cannot resist agreeing with you AND supporting the troops, who I know a few friends and friends children over there as well, but politics get very heated and we are all emotionally drained from RA. HUGZ RoxJesus, chill out kids. If you're so high and mighty about your opinions, then step off of mine. It's really pathetic - yes I said it's pathetic - that you got so uppity over what I said. I never named either one of you specifically, so take your Valium and chill out. I stated my opinion on the matter, based on all of the things that I have heard and read and people I have spoken to. Not *just* on this forum. I wasn't trying to rile anyone up. If I want to do that, you'll know. Trust me. When crispy there was a better forum for this topic, I agreed. Even offered to start one! So relax. If you don't want it to be an ugly topic, or you think this isn't the place, then drop it. Kay? Kay. Laters. Are we not fortunate that we can freely speak our opinions?I hate to say it, but it was almost refreshing to see a topic responded to with such passion that had nothing to do with our health. I would say that we are all alive and kicking. Katie, I'm with you and Mark on this issue. There should be more war protests not less. If we truly support our troops we should speak up for them to come home.Yes, Deanna, I feel the same.
Not only is this little brawl a sign of life outside RA, (I don't like brawls, but it is still a sign of life), it has nothing to do with healthfood cures.
If we must hiss and spit, and I suppose sometimes we must, at least this is a new one.
My contribution: I think it's a shame, but still a truth, that we can't discuss politics in this country any more. It's not just this board. It's at just about any street corner or dinner table. It is so emotional, personal, intense, extreme for almost everyone that the opportunity for intelligent discourse and debate is about gone. I really miss that.
Anyone who speaks an opinion that's unpopular with the person who hears it risks not just a vigorous debate but a venomous response or even an emotional mauling.
Somehow we feel so threatened by differing views that we've lost the ability even to hear a different opinion.
And it's not just the hearing we're getting bad at. We give our opions with more barbs or pre-emptive diffensiveness than ever, thus spurring an even more upset response from the other side.
It's just all too interpersonally scary to allow for exchange. It's this condition, even more than than the actual state of our political situation, which is worrisome enough, that makes me worry about us.
Ah, well.
Oh, and nothing I just said was a reference, not even a veiled one, to anyone else on this board or anything that has been said on this thread. I'm hissing and spitting at The World, not at anyone here.
I did not post the topic to be a political debate and so while you may not think it belongs here maybe and maybe not... but 350 plus billion is a whole lot of money yup a whole lot of money and If Isreal can invent a flying nanotech killing machine the size of a wasp then someone could make a better knee replacment or find a better medicine then prednisone.. sorry for those of you that love prednisone but I think good ole prednisone sucks yup ... needed I suppose but it's a evil drug. Yes politics sucks but medicine is mired in politics Don't think so then why does it take a drug 13 years plus to get approved by the FDA a process so difficult that many companies don't even bother to bring something to market ubless they think they will make a killing on it.. thats medicine in america You will probably be mad at me for saying it but thats what it is....
http://www.expresshealthcaremgmt.com/200602/technology01.sht ml
I just think it is sad that here in THe good ole USA we can't even get this surgery if we needed it and some day I will probably need it and so yes I'm selfish I want the best technology in the world If I have to lose body parts I sure as hell wish and hope I can live a somewhat normal life afterwards.... all I'm doing is sharing thoughts and feelings your thoughts probably vary but how is this related to iraq I suppose you will ask and to that I will just say That I would fathom that 70 billion dollars might Go a long way to advancing some medical advancements that could benefit many people but alas, I don't get to decide how we spend cash in America and really like most americans I never thought about these things funny how RA can make you think to much maybe I just think to much. I just think its kind of ironic that someone has the genius to invent a flying nanotech wasp but in many ways in the medical field well medicine is still in the dark ages in many ways. I quess I just wish that same genius that can make flying wasps would invest some of that knowledge into making life better for someone who I don't know lost a leg maybe? Think about that they can make a little wasp that can fly ok so it's 3 years away but still if you can make a tiny wasp to fly around and kill people maybe some of that same brillance could have made a bionic hand and who knows maybe I just think to much.I quess I just wish there was more time but really when you have RA time and your perception of time changes.. it use to not bother me that it takes 13 years to geta new medicine to market now 13 years is a eternity..... funny how RA changes your perceptions did I ever tell you I hate RA? it scares me and I wonder often how much can my body take I don't know I hope for the best or try to..... at times it gets hard very hard.... it's scary and I have to just figure out how to try and work and survive RA whats kind of sad is that you never think about these things till one day there it is facing you and so maybe my thinking is wrong but RA can change the way you think.. If you get mad at me for thinking these things well that's ok too...
the message board is to share thoughts so we should not have to say well I'm scared to write what I feel down because I have to be thankful I can write today.. sadly that may not always be the case . I hope if I ever need to get a new knee I can get one like that one in India that kind of stuff encourages me... I quess my point is this If they can make a flying wasp think about that a flying wasp then they can do far more in medicine then they have right now. I quess we should be thankful its 2006 but I'll be honest latly i often wish it was 2036 but alas this the hand I was delt I have to get through it somehow but it's hard... hope mark hope... I gotta hang on to hope. Hey at least RA has not stolen my ability to think yet.......... and yea I am a thinker probably my downfall. I hate RA.. yup somehow I have to fight it tho how I'm not sure yet I can't let this illness destroy me but it is trying it's best to.
mark
RKGal I agree. It hurts me deeply that when I want to talk about politics, it seems to always end in anger. :( Politics is turning into religion. Can't talk about it, can't criticize it, can't change it. Eventually what was once such a great system, will become just what most religion has become. Extremely one sided and hidden behind a curtain. And the majority of people will look away when anyone brings it up. In both scenarios it's sad. Our country was founded on BOTH religion and politics, and yet we can't seem to do anything with either one of them without starting a huge debate or creating problems. I have a passion for both so sometimes I get a little......heated. LoL But I'm certainly not trying to make anyone mad, or tell anyone their wrong. I just want people to be fired up about it and talk about it and learn. This was a nice change in topic, as Deanna said. And we are all very much alive. LoL Hey maybe the last election, the country is becoming more like mindedPeace
I want an exo-skeleton to help out all the things that don't work right any more. And, can you make it cool looking like straight from the X-men. And, make me sexy looking again because I really miss that.
I just wish they would find a cure. I am so tired of being diagnosed with more things for which there is no cure. A cure, please, a cure.
Yes, our priorities seem all out of whack. Teachers get paid nothing while corporate big shots get millions. War is funded but it usually takes donations of really dedicated people to get medical research going.
And, I don't understand why I cannot speak my mind without insulting a friend. I remember a time when I could. I think that this will change though. All these underlying emotions will come bursting out. As Americans we just weren't designed to stuff it all inside.
I think that this topic is a great diversion from the usual "this hurts and that hurts". And let's all take a lesson from Roxy. Who has had any more criticism than she has and she just took it in stride, weeded out the good from the bad and went on with her life. And, she never scolded anyone for their opinion. Now that's what I call class!! Way to go Roxy.
Either you take it personally....and feel the need to attach back; or you take the opinion for what it's worth and move on.
Either way these message boards are never boring.
Wow, I spend a day away from the computer, and have 3 pages to catch up on this thread!
[QUOTE=RASara82]
CAN'T WE AGREE TO DISAGREE?
RASara82, I would like nothing more than to be able to agree to disagree with people who believe differently than I do. But why does it seem that when politics come up, people forget how to be polite? We can talk about money, we can talk about sex, I think we can even talk about religion and be careful not to step on other peoples' toes...but when politics comes up it seems to be an excuse for manners to fly out the window.
Mark1 I'm sorry you are hurting so much. I worry a lot about the same things that you do and life just isn't the way it ought to be. I always remind myself --welcome to the human race-- So much could be better if people only cared about one another. If only some people weren't so interested in making a lot of money- sometimes at the expense of other people - or being on power trips - if only our resources could be directed at ways to end suffering it would be a much better world. It's so hard to have to keep on working in the pain and unpredictability that we have with this disease. I won't babble on any more but I also think that if research was done a lot differently and money was spent differently we could relieve so much suffering just like so many of those idealistic young people in Iraq are trying to do.
very true Tiana
if only drug companies were not only interested in making drugs they know they can make a killing on.. sad but true.
drug company A-- Hey this drug can stop inflamation
Owner-- "hmmmmmm can I make big money if we make it?"
drug company nope only 2 million people would benefit
owner-- "only 2 million hell drop that research immediatly I only want big money drugs in the pipeline"
yup thats the sad truth of drug research in america
http://www.forbes.com/2001/12/17/1217amgen.html
I get suspicious because the biologics are a big profit industry. What is there to motivate pharamceutical companies to come up with better options when they are making billions off our disease and we are all guinea pigs as far as the long term effects of these drugs. That is my attraction to AP therapy. Its motives are not greed
PS If you ever want to talk politics, I will send you my email. I find politics invigorating. Probably not good as what is going on can make you angry but I would much rather see people angry then apathetic.
Hissing and spitting included, this thread has been one of the most real and refreshing discussions related to politics I've heard in a long time. I'm not suggesting we continue it, but I do want to acknowledge that this is a pretty cool group of people.
Katie, I want to mention that I really enjoyed your post that included the analogy of politics and religion. I was nodding away at your whole post, sharing your feelings and enjoying the way you expressed yourself.
And, Katie again, this is a different thread and a different board, but I just read your post in the excellent thread about RA and depression at the RA Sushi board.
You astounded me with that post. It was so beautiful, eloquent, true, wrenching, generous, gripping. I've been enjoying the spirit and intelligence in your posts for some time, as I do so many of these wise, funny, spirited characters around here. But where have you been hiding that you can WRITE like that?
Anyone who hasn't checked out that thread on the RA Sushi board is missing something.
Wanna know something sad? I have to be exhausted or pissed or truely depressed to write anything like that. Heh. Otherwise I'm just another schmuck! Katie, the one thing in life you will never be is just another schmuck. You are just going to just have to accept the fact that you are talented and dynamic. and maybe a little crazy....just kidding Katie! Well said Karen. :) Though, I've had long talks with my dad and many other retired military, and current military folk, and they are in the general consensus that we will never have another draft, save for Armageddon. So I honestly wouldn't worry about it too much. Hehe. I was so VERY excited that the dems won the house this past election. We were SWIMMING in repubs. for the past 2 years, and it was just over-kill. I think it should always be a nice even balance, so that we get everyones viewpoint in there. But I don't make the rules. I can't say that I'm really affiliated with any particular party, as I like to see plenty of each around. Too much of one or the other seems to be a bad thing. Bush ALONE is far too much repub. for me! HahThats when you best say Ohh MY... because while most folks will think hey look We solved it.... that's when there will be a conflict that will make Iraq and afganny seem very mild.
It will be the calm before the storm if you will but the storm is coming I know we've heard it all before but while war drums beat and terrorists rage I know hey everythings normal over there it's when it get's deathly quite and everyone talks Peace that the real trouble is right arond the corner. I keep my eyes on when they start to force Isreal into peace plans or giving up land or some land for peace deal when I see that begin to happen Then I will be concerned because I know instead of hey how amazing we fixed IT... IT is about to explode far far worse than iraq is now.when there is a false sense of security in Isreal and they think they finally have the peace plan thats when trouble is coming. So yea the things that are happening are bad and I pray everyday for the soldiers but while those drums beat I know hey business as usual for the middle east It's when that hey we finally have a lasting peace agreement thing comes along and everyone let's there quard down then .. that means troubles coming..... because there will be a peace plan that will work someday...
when will it happen who knows noone does and there may be war in the middle east for the rest of our lives but thats normal..... It's when that hey we've finally got a lasting peace solution that comes out that I would be concerned...
We will probably never see this peace plan in our lifetime or it could happen very soon.... either way when it happens is when I would get more concerned the terrorist can rage and threatin and beat there drums of war... or jihad heck they have beat that drum for a long long time.. when Iran says stuff like we will wipe you off the face of the earth I know ok everythings as always in the middle east... When Iran says hey Israel lets be friends lets end our long conflict and finally stop this constant conflict hey hezzbollah lay down all your arms let's be friends finally and forever we have a peace watch out........when syria says lets be friends let's be good neighbors let's have the final solution to end our conflict... oh boy look out.........because I just know We are not going to fix this conflict it will be fixed someday thats a givin.. but it's not going to be anything that the USA or the european union or the UN does that will finally solve the middle east and really this war in iraq is all connected to the conflict over Palestine not in a direct way but it's connected.. The Iranian leader right now thinks he must cause chaos in the world to bring on the advent of a religious event for their faith.. and so he will rage and beat his drums as will hezzbollah and all the others because right now they are convinced they can bring this supposed chaos to pass... will they... time will tell
It's interesting that Iran is so into beating their war drums latly tho if you go back in history Iran is persia... iT is all very interesting the middle east and how it will all play out some day. Unfortunatly for now it's war on and that is normal for the middle east. It is when they say hey lets all be friends... that trouble is coming.....
raise your hand if you have been to iraq....
-Jon
Thanks Jon for what you have done for us. I told Katie (no you are not a schmuck, yes, you are crazy and that is why I luvs yas so) I was going to stay out of this one since I have very strong feelings about it and didn't want to offend anyone. With that said, I hope I don't offend anyone and please remember this is just my opinion.Please support our troops. Please. While the actions and reasons we may not agree with about why we are over there, it is our sons, daughters, grandchildren, husbands, wives, nieces, nephews, etc. over there doing the actual work. May whatever higher power they believe in watch over them and keep them safe. There was a church group going to funerals of Fallen Soldiers in our WI area protesting the funerals of these soldiers. How horrific is that.
Saddam needed to be taken out of power. There is so much oil over there that we need and the threat of us not having it moved the big money and power in this country to do something about it. We are an oil greedy oil consuming nation. While we have plenty of our own supply, it is unfortunately located where precious wildlife and wetlands are. There has to be a compromise somewhere between conservation groups and oil companies on how to get to this oil so we can be self sufficient and not depend on countries that treat their citizens very poorly because they hold power and that power has gone to their heads and really whacked them out.
It would be nice if Bush did match what we are spending on war with medical research. And schools...and government programs for those without insurance, sufficient insurance, and insufficient health care. Reality is that big money controls the nation and they can afford top notch insurance and docs and don't really care whether we can or not. As long as they are treated and treated well. Mark had mentioned something about stem cell research. I am all in favor of that. And I am borderline conservative Christian. But I look at the benefits of the research. It is a give and take situation.
I don't think there is going to be a draft. Hotspots are very quietly and covertly taken care of by Special Forces lately.
I do feel Iraq is just another Viet Nam and we need to get out. But we can't. Civil unrest, training the new police force, advising the new government, trying to please many different religious beliefs is just going to take time. And unfortunately lives. There was civil unrest there to begin with, but our prescence has just excerbated it and brought it into the limelight.
I really would love to see Peace on Earth. I probably won't. Too many whack jobs whose mothers didn't tell them "NO" enough when they were children running countries. And thinking they can do what they want to whomever they want and there be no consequences for their actions.
Karen...I can understand completely your fear about your boys. I have a daughter that is h*ll bent on going into the military the minute she graduates high school. I don't have to worry about the draft. She is going whether we like it or not. She loves her country and feels it is her duty to protect it and continue the tradition from hubby's side of the family of joining the military. She wants to be a Navy pilot and fly off of ships. YAY4ME and about 10 zillion new grey hairs when she goes in lol.
WOW.Very Interesting folks....I'll just add a few things. Remember where you get all your " IRAQ " information. Probably the 24 hr a day CNN's or CNBC of Fox. What ya really need to do is speak to someone who is there. I did. His first staement was I cannot beleive the crap on TV here in the states. All they show is a car bomb. Not the hospitals, schools, dams etc. Never show the Iraq people who are SO gratefull that SAddam is gone. The soldiers want to finish the job that was started. That was his quote. We can debate the issue of wether we should have gone there but its seems everybody has forgotton how they felt on 9/12. NOw before ya get your undies in a bunch I'm not saying Hussein was responsible for 9/11. I beleive relegion over there is much stronger then boundries. Radical Islam has hated us long before 9/11. ex. First World Trade center bombing, USS Cole Beiruit, and the list goes on. Let the MILITARY handle Iraq and get out after that, when the job is done or if there is no way it can be accomplished. It also seems everyone has forgotton the 17 UN resulutions Saddam failed to obey. His use of WMD against the Kurds. They are using that video in his trial. If you can take a look and see what kind of man he was. Torture was a common occurence. I could go on but I pray the war ends quickly and hopefully an independant government that is working to it's full potential. The odds are against that but we can hope.....I believe we can't change things on our own. They need to work together to build their country and make it right and right now they are at war with each other which makes it hard.
But please know, we aren't there just to fight or keep peace, we are there helping rebuild what we broke and we are training their new soldiers to take over when we leave. Until it is done we cant think of leaving or it would be a country that would easily be taken over again probably by someone far worse than the last leader.
I personally have met families who have relatives there or those who have reinlisted and they are actually proud to be there. I just hope everyone can support what they think is right.
i agree with you bubbagump. I think we do need to get out of there but we have to help the Iraqi army restrenghten and help rebuild what we have destroyed. I know many people that have been over in Iraq. A friend of mine that ive known my whole life was over there twice, a highschool friend was over there twice and my pastors son was over there for almost a year and before he was about to come home he was almost killed. I thank God everyday for those that are over seas risking their lives to help other people. Granted i also believe that we need help over here too dont get me wrong but for those that are out there on the front lines risking their lives day in day out, we all have to be thankfull for them. If you look back to every war that we have been involved in you have to be thankful for those that voluntered to be in the military and those that were drafted because without them (and without help of our allies) we would be a heck of a lot worse off then we are now. If we would have never been envolved in WWII who knows what could have happened and if Hitlers regiem would still have been in power and thus the power of him would have been handed down. Do i belive that we should have been in this war in Iraq? Yes and No. Yes because Saddam Hussian's power needed to be taken away from him and this was probably going to be the only way that was going to happen. No only because we have alot of problems in our own country. But seeing as how we are in this war wether the country likes it or not we cant just say to the Iraqi people "ok we blew up your buildings killed all these peope, your military and police have no idea how to stop the violence that is happening, we're gonna leave now" how would that look to other countries? That the USA is willing to go in and stop horrible people from being in power but they arent willing to help the government build up again? Just look at the reaction that France recieved when they wanted to back out and not support the war, I think eveyone that wasnt french looked down on them. Granted im not a big supporter of the French to begin with but everyone would be looking at us in the same way. It is too bad that we blew up so much of their infrastructure and Halliburton is making billions supposedly re-building. Cheney being a CEO of Halliburton and major stockholder - Doesn't anyone see a conflict of interest ????????????????Oh roxy, that's just the tip of the "conflict-of-interest-iceberg" :| I enjoy this radio station. Give it a chance... well if any of you have members in the military
heres a wish for there save return...
I Think Iraq has now become a defacto war between Iran and
Saudi Arabia and we are in the middle..
20,000 more troops will not fix this I am afraid to say
It is a full flung civil war with our troops in the middle Not a
good place to be.
I really wish that hundreds of billions would have gone to
medical reseach instead...
If Israel can build a wasp that flys around and kills people
than what could we do if we had different priorities?
I think we could accomplish much if only our efforts were
focused different..
how about a bionic hand lord knows i may need one some day[/
P]
or 2
thoughts?
[/QUOTE]
I agree that the Bush administration did not take into consideration the social/religious environment of the countries involved. I also think that he did not understand the range that the Muslim religion reaches across our globe. He has a tendency to not listen to other opinions that disagree with his own. This is very dangerous in a leader of a country.
But the mess is there. Unfortunately, if Bush stays true to form, it isn't going to improve because that is outside his character. Over and over again, he has taken on the "big bully, I'm going to get my way by superior forces" attitude.
And, good people die. It will take either collective voice of the American people or another leader in office to change that. Yes, we are stuck with the misconception that if we are against the war, we are not supporting the troops. In my heart, they are two different things. This is volunteer forces that are over there. They were not drafted. They loved their country and their families to go because the leader in charge said, "Go." They are valiant.
But how easy is it for the men in the White House who have their own vested interests in oil and reconstruction to say, "Go." They have gained a lot and have not lost their children. Although, in my opinion, they are all our children over there.
The plans were ill-laid. Sounder voices were ignored. Now, here's this mess and yes, it does remind me of Vietnam. We can't just walk out of this country because we demolished it. And, we cannot keep just sending over troops. Somehow the fire has to be diminshed without the continuous blood of our children. That takes strategy and diplomacy. It takes a willingness to work with other countries and across different cultures.
I don't see that in our current leadership. I wish I did.
I thought the station was AIrAmerica.commie. I listen to it for a brief time. Way too left. Like listening to Rush L Way to rightone thing MR bush is not aware of is the huge range of propoganda on TV in Jordan and Egypt that is anti american/ anti Israel anti zionist. Ir's not just those countries its all accross the middle east. In Jordan they show a tv show where americans drink palestinian blood that Israel'is kill kids to make matzo and it goes on and on and on. Bushy sure for a christian that he claims himself to be had no clue what the region at all. All he thinks foolishly is if ya make someone "free" they will throw roses at your feet and really folks that is what mr cheeney was expecting... roses.. Imagine the horror on his face when our soldiers were greeted with RPG's. not flower
they had no idea of the propoganda and hatred towards us there is NO IDEA. they hate US in the middle east. why ? name a reason.
Mark1...Not sure how you know what the President knows or does not know, but my guess is he is aware of the TV propaganda over there. AS I recall out initial deployment was met pretty well. Remember when they tore down the Saddam statue? It has developed into this quagmire over time. Reliogion and economics are the usual things that start wars. here is no different Ok guys, I have an idea that will solve this shortage of troops. Let's empty all of the jails and prisons and send the prisoners to Iraq. These guys like to kill and abuse so they will feel right at home. And what a burden will be lifted for the taxpayers! OMG, can you just imagine? And I bet that other thiefs and killers will take a second look at this picture and perhaps change their mind. Am I dreaming? Some of these men on death row have been there for umteen years and probably would like the chance to kill again. Let's ship em out!! Let's not even vote on it, let's do it! The sad fact is that our president didn't have a plan. The statue toppledI have an old friend who assumed I supported the war. She has sent me emails for years about the war...supporting the war etc. Recently she sent me a very graphic email about what the soliders in Iraq are going through. Because my 20 year old nephew was recently deployed to Baghdad, I decided to respond. I am sharing my response with you so you understand my feelings about the war in Iraq.
I say this with the deepest love and respect for your feelings and beliefs. However, I am responding to this email because I need you to respect mine.
I would appreciate it if you did not send me this type of email. They are deeply disturbing to me.
My beautiful, wonderul 20 year old nephew has been in Iraq for the past 2.5 months. He is not just in Iraq but in the heart of Baghdad and his in Army Special Operations which is dangerous business. Last week 3 young men in his unit were killed.
The photos you sent were deeply disturbing...and not just for the reasons you think. First, I do not need to visually see what my nephew is experiencing...my imagination can take care of that, thank you very much.
They are also deeply disturbing because they are a painful reminder of the foolhardiness of our current President and the people he has surrounding him. You see...I was very opposed to this war even before my nephew ever enlisted. I am now vehmently opposed and much more vocal about it.
I am by no means an expert on the Middle East. However, I have been fascinated and studied the region since junior high school. I have read, listened and taken courses on the subject. What I have learned is that no outsi